Getting ready to operate GNU Taler in Germany

warkdarrior

I haven't looked at Taler in a while. What capabilities do they have to transfer money around without being surveilled? Also are transactions final and irreversible?

Eueudhsbsj32

I don't see how EU regulators would allow payment privacy in any meaningful way. It will be choked out at key junctions with KYC in the same way crypto has.

rvz

I think GNU Taler missed their chance of adoption since the world has moved on and was impatient with their progress. Blockchains that support stablecoins are already here and millions of people already use them (and soon agents will use them as well). All for worldwide, instant and extremely low fee payments and transfers.

hangrybear666

Never having heard of it before, the moment I read "cash like tokens in your account" I was immediately out. Also claiming buyer privacy when the money ultimately has to come from a bank transaction or another digital transaction leaving some sort of trail is a false illusion.

Deukhoofd

So this is trying to compete against Wero, which is being backed by most major western European banks? I wish them luck, but I somewhat doubt they can compete against that.

anonymous908213

tldr of my understanding (do correct me if I'm wrong): Neither buyer nor seller are anonymous. Your bank knows your ID-verified identity and that you have deposited X talers. However, nobody knows when, where, or even if you spend those talers. You are free to spend talers on eg. a e-book about Tiananmen Square and the bank/state will never know that you did. The seller, on the other hand, has no protections, and will be destroyed for selling an e-book about Tiananmen Square. Also, you can't realistically buy a physical book about Tiananmen Square because you will give up your address to the shipper and by extension to the state. If my understanding is correct... it's not good enough. In a free society we should be able to both purchase and publish e-books about Tiananmen Square, and this does not permit that.

jttnr

I'm a happy GLS Bank customer, and I've just learned about its involvement in Taler. Pretty awesome. Europe desperately needs its own digital payment solutions to reduce its dependence on US companies and its exposure to sanctions that could target EU citizens if the president has a bad day. GLS is also on board with Wero, which, unfortunately, hasn't seen big adoption yet. I really hope Taler takes off.

shevy-java

The sooner Europeans decouple themselves - including security, including a nuclear arsenal - from crazy Trump the better. In all aspects. Without exceptions. Canadians understand this problem much better than many european politicians. In particular Merz is like a lame obedient duck here. And Macron too now, after failing the french population again and again. He had many years time to fix France and did not do so. That is deliberate failure.

F3nd0

Wishing Taler lots of success and hoping for the best. Adopting something like this should be a given, but unfortunately freedom and privacy aren’t seen as essentials, not even in the EU.

ETH_start

GNU Taler provides a backdoor for spying. You cannot create an open system in line with FOSS principles and be compliant with laws that mandate centralized control. That's why this project began with an architecture that prefaces dependence on the backdoor key holders, and is now going even more pronouncedly in the direction of asymmetrical power relationships, by becoming an entirely centralized bank. This is the only way it can remain compliant with the laws in question. If you want to maintain FOSS principles and provide people with monetary technology, you need to be noncompliant — whether in letter or just in spirit — with the law in most of the world, where the law limits people's access to financial activity, in order to fulfil a public policy of empowering gatekeepers.

vr46

You can barely use non-EC debit cards in Germany, if any card at all. I’m all for fast-forwarding and you can pull this off I will donate towards a statue in your honour.

procone

It's "money" but it has to be permanently connected to the Internet and it *expires* if disconnected for too long?? This is infinitely worse than Bitcoin. https://www.taler.net/en/faq.html > Taler e-money is issued with a validity period. One month before the expiration date, your wallet should automatically exchange any digital cash that is about to expire for new digital cash with an extended validity period. However, if your wallet is offline for an extended period of time, it may be unable to do so. Ensure your wallet is regularly online to avoid losing money due to expiration!

zombot

> GNU Taler is a privacy-preserving payment system. Customers can stay anonymous, but merchants can not hide their income through payments with GNU Taler. This helps to avoid tax evasion and money laundering. > The primary use case of GNU Taler is payments; it is not meant as a store of value. Payments are always backed by an existing currency. This looks like it could be useful anywhere.